How to fix tanks?

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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Ninja » Wed Feb 01, 2017 4:20 am

Yes, I hate bad grammar and poor structure. That doesn't mean that I become agitated by seeing it. I just point out how to fix it.
"Grammar is the logic of speech, even as logic is the grammar of reason." ~ Richard Chenevix Trench

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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Big Bad Bug » Wed Feb 01, 2017 4:29 am

Wow, you actually understood what I wrote! :lol:

Anyways, yes, I am fully aware of the fact that both stats and abilities need to be balanced. You ought to know that I of all people shouldn't need to specifiy that I want heroes to be balanced. ;)
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Zonoro13 » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:12 am

Ninja wrote:That may be so, but it still seems a bit much to me. Whatever.

Mutilating your sentences with horribly purposeful incorrect grammar does nothing to me emotionally, so your "twisted" emoticon is unwarranted. :cool:

I've had enough.

Stop pretending you care about grammar when you use the word "whatever" as if it were a sentence. You're old enough to stop being rude to people who make different mistakes than you do.


P.S. You should go to Discord.
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Ninja » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:25 am

"Whatever" can be used as an interjection. ;)
"Grammar is the logic of speech, even as logic is the grammar of reason." ~ Richard Chenevix Trench

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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Zonoro13 » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:26 am

Ninja wrote:"Whatever" can be used as an interjection. ;)

An interjection is something used in everyday speech, not a complete thought.
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Sinque Productions » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:32 am

Not, to, be, that, guy but, arguing, over, grammar, is, a, waste, of, time, for, everyone, and, for, this, thread. And, getting, angry, is, a, waste, too. Do, it, on, Discord, or, something.

In case someone missed it, I wrote the tank would be able to attack all three enemies at once. And yes, reducing the tank's attack would balance it. Or maybe they can attack two enemies at once so they are better at one for all around damage balance. Or maybe their damage could get divided by the amount of enemies they are attacking.

A tank might do 30 to one, 15 to two, and 10 to three.

Or the could do 15 and attack at most 2 enemies at once but block three.

Or they could just do 13 (1 enemy is less likely than 3 so I reduced it a little bit) damage to 1, 2, 3, which would balance between 1 vs. 3.

My favorite is the first one, but really, attack doesn't matter very much on a tank. They don't do much damage anyway, the stall and have health.
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Ninja » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:35 am

[+] SPOILER
Zonoro13 wrote:
Ninja wrote:"Whatever" can be used as an interjection. ;)

An interjection is something used in everyday speech, not a complete thought.


That's not entirely true. Interjections are used in everyday speech, but they are also used in many other kinds of communication. They are to be used to indicate either emotion or the disposition of the author toward what is being discussed. In this case, I used the latter function.
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by warbot1000 » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:37 am

Doing more damage to one enemy would make more sense. Would the tanks armour / magic resist be affected by multiple enemies as well? Also with bigger opponents for example executioners or bruisers (is that what the saurians with whips are called?) Would the amount of units the tank could block be reduced?

my ideas
http://www.ironhidegames.com/forums/vie ... =15&t=4760
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Zonoro13 » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:39 am

Ninja wrote:That's not entirely true. Interjections are used in everyday speech, but they are also used in many other kinds of communication. They are to be used to indicate either emotion or the disposition of the author toward what is being discussed. In this case, I used the latter function.

Whatever is not a sentence.
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Big Bad Bug » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:41 am

Sinque Productions wrote:Not, to, be, that, guy but, arguing, over, grammar, is, a, waste, of, time, for, everyone, and, for, this, thread. And, getting, angry, is, a, waste, too. Do, it, on, Discord, or, something.


I, think, that, I, started, a, meme, ;) .

Sinque Productions wrote:In case someone missed it, I wrote the tank would be able to attack all three enemies at once. And yes, reducing the tank's attack would balance it. Or maybe they can attack two enemies at once so they are better at one for all around damage balance. Or maybe their damage could get divided by the amount of enemies they are attacking.

A tank might do 30 to one, 15 to two, and 10 to three.

Or the could do 15 and attack at most 2 enemies at once but block three.

Or they could just do 13 (1 enemy is less likely than 3 so I reduced it a little bit) damage to 1, 2, 3, which would balance between 1 vs. 3.


Don't forget Kingmaker's suggestion for the heroes to also be less durable against 1 enemy compared to 3 so that they don't overwhelm single targets in order to be useful against multiple enemies. :)

First idea: That makes sense. I like that the best, as well, but I must reiterate that not all tanks need to have this same mechanic. The general idea of being capable of taking on more than one enemy is good, but implementing it all in the same way is not. That would take away the opportunity to create multiple unique playstyles between each tank and instead make it a matter of which tank is the strongest in terms of dps and durability. ;)

Second idea: That's interesting; it hadn't crossed my mind as a possibility. Although, it would get messy when you may want a different enemy to be receiving damage than the 2 being attacked.

Third idea: What? :lol: Sorry, I have no idea what you mean. Could you explain it in more detail for me, please? :oops:

@Warbot1000 They're called, "Saurian Brutes." :)
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Ninja » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:42 am

[+] SPOILER
@Zonoro13: It doesn't have to be. It is one of the eight major parts of speech in the English language, and is respected as correct by reputable sources.
"Grammar is the logic of speech, even as logic is the grammar of reason." ~ Richard Chenevix Trench

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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Zonoro13 » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:48 am

Ninja wrote:It doesn't have to be. It is one of the eight major parts of speech in the English language, and is respected as correct by reputable sources.

When educated people write in English, they use sentences with at least one independent clause and perhaps some dependent clauses. It's curious how little you respect this convention, while obsessing over another just as arbitrary.
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Ninja » Wed Feb 01, 2017 5:52 am

Zonoro13 wrote:
Ninja wrote:It doesn't have to be. It is one of the eight major parts of speech in the English language, and is respected as correct by reputable sources.

When educated people write in English, they use sentences with at least one independent clause and perhaps some dependent clauses. It's curious how little you respect this convention, while obsessing over another just as arbitrary.


I agree that writing in sentences is the most common form of written communication in the English language. That does not excuse the fact that interjections exist and that they are totally correct.
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Zonoro13 » Wed Feb 01, 2017 6:01 am

Ninja wrote:I agree that writing in sentences is the most common form of written communication in the English language. That does not excuse the fact that interjections exist and that they are totally correct.

A single word cannot convey an idea, only an emotion. Such "sentences" are not a meaningful part of written English. If you can hold every forumer to the standard of perfect grammar, than I can hold you to the standard of perfectly formal English.
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by The Kingmaker » Wed Feb 01, 2017 7:03 am

*ignores dick-measuring contest that arguably I started*

Ultimately I think we're at a crossroads as to what we think a tank is. If we're talking about blocking three enemies at once, and talking about killing three enemies at once, we are talking abiut very different heroes. I'm concerning myself with the former for now. Save your twenty-four armed-seventeen weapon holding octopus damage-dealer hero for killing three enemies at once. Let's talk about the logistics of blocking three.

First this would be unparalleled. This hero would essentially be a barracks all on their own, holding back as many enemies as Paladins, or Templars. Next, however, enemies with any kind of ranged function would probably be the bane of this hero as if you move the hero to engage, unless it pulls enemies towards it when it engages, mages and ranged units aren't going to walk into it and would just fire off attacks while it only attacks one. Hence, as I suggested and kinda thought was obvious, dealing with one enemy fast might be useful too, making an argument for keeping some of the damage.

The hero in my mind whenever I'm discussing this is Grawl, albeit with wider shoulders and shards on his head. When facing three enemies he would punch on his left and right and head butt the middle one. If he deals his regular damage when facing three enemies at once, dealing 1.5-2x damage when facing 2 enemies and 2-2.5x damage when facing one would allow for simple utility to work down one singular threat with towers or just to block three.

Of course supporting abilities like heals and temporary invulnerabilitues will probably be very useful to mega-Grawl, but they can be worked out from there.

Also answering the name of the thread and not the discussion began in the OP about three enemies: tanks can be fixed by understanding the other roles you want them to fit on the battle and shying away from just dealing damage with them. Differentiating tank aesthetics and origins and powers would fix them to some degree and make them far more interesting, and being able to create a play style with a hero whose primary function is already filed on stats alone is something not many heroes can boast
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Juice Box » Wed Feb 01, 2017 10:05 am

Ninja please just shut up with your constant derailment. Nobody cares about your petty grammatical nuances. Let Sinque and the others discuss what this thread was made for.
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by SealDarklight » Wed Feb 01, 2017 3:53 pm

Blocking 3 enemies in my opinion is not good enough, Why not as many enemies at once? That would be far better since its easier for the hero to block while the artillery deals or the hero itself deals area damage basically but there is a cost when it comes to enemies that deal high damage like werewolves or mooks and i dont think that would be gamebreaking since more than 10 enemies would deal boss damage to a hero and hero will die quickly unless it heals itself. The heroes that i can think should block more than 1 would be Grawl and Razz and Rags since two of these heroes not only look like giant enemies but they also deal area damage being Grawl more of a wall and Razz and Rags like damaging type since it deals area damage.
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Big Bad Bug » Thu Feb 02, 2017 3:33 am

I feel that Ironhide should try making heroes that use skills rather than have random complicated stat changes depending on what enemies they fight. It's excessive that way, when using abilities to do that results in naturally making a really cool hero.

Here's my evidence. ;)
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by Sinque2 » Thu Feb 02, 2017 6:05 am

This is Sinque, I forgot my last account password :/

Anyway, I think 3 is enough, and I like the idea of ONE hero having it. MAYBE two. That is that characters uniqueness.
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Re: How to fix tanks?

by RaZoR LeAf » Thu Feb 02, 2017 11:56 am

Sinque2 wrote:This is Sinque, I forgot my last account password :/


Couldn't you just use the "I Forgot my password" link to generate a new one, rather than make an entirely new account?
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